• Dental Phobia Support

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Here we go again...

Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

How about saying this is a very big deal for me to have treatment, I love how gentle you are in my mouth and attentive to my concerns. I'm trying hard to trust you and not be afraid, but I could use some encouragment now and then.

Thanks for phrasing that for me. I like the way you've put it - it sounds so reasonable when you say it like that!

The difficulty is in me having the courage to say anything. I have GAD and one side of that for me is constantly fearing everyone disliking or thinking badly of or being angry with me etc, and huge fear of embarrassment (both mine and other people's). That's partly why I need so much reassurance and encouragement etc in my appoinments - the other part being the phobia, and they feed into each other. It also makes me terrified to say anything that could be seen as critical or demanding, or make me look stupid, or embarrass the other person. (Hence all the stressing over sending emails to the practice etc.) I'm scared that if I try to tell him how I feel, it'll make him annoyed with me or despise me.

So far in my appointments I've kind of been doing everything I could to try to please him (which has meant mostly ignoring/trying to hide my fear, since that's seemed to be what he wanted), whilst wishing it was the other way round! :rolleyes: When I trust someone, I can start to let go of this, and feel I have 'permission' to say no or to voice my concerns etc, because I know they actually want me to tell them if I'm unhappy. I suppose it's a catch 22 at the minute in that, because I don't trust him yet, I don't feel 'safe' asking him for help; but if I don't ask and he doesn't change, I don't think I'll ever feel safe with him.

So I think I need to do this - I just don't know where to get the confidence from. I think I'll bottle it if I try to say something to his face. :( But if I wrote it down and gave it to him or something, I'd feel so pathetic. I think time may be a bit of an issue in this too - he always wants to get straight on when I go in the room (which I find very hard), then at the end he seems to expect me to leave straight away. When I've tried to talk, I've got the impression I'm holding him up.

Do you think it's better to email (I'd have to do it through the general address though), or write it down and take it with me, or to try to say it in person?
 
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Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

When I have a good dentist that I can talk to and who listen's to me I am a nervous patient, when I have a dentist like the one you are describing that I feel uneasy with I am full blown phobic and a complete mess attending any appointments I might have.
About 12 years ago I found a really good dentist that became more of a friend than a dentist we used to joke and laugh as I shook in the chair, but I trusted him and if he said I needed blue teeth then blue teeth I would have had. A relationship a bit like you had with the dentist you used to have. I was pampered and encouraged so got work done. He died and as he was a one man band that was it, I was devastated. I found another dentist, I had two or three appointments, within these appointments with this new dentist I had a filling, I was uncomfortable going to she her, and when I said I couldn't close my teeth properly and my jaw ached and that I thought it was the filling bite. She was annoyed I questioned her work and I just thought I couldn't stand going to see her it was not right, I was uncomfortable and terrified. Full on phobic.

I left seeing a dentist for 5 years, I couldn't face going, all this time I stressed, thinking my teeth were all rotting and would fall out, and about how your feeling now.

A tooth did break and I had to find another dentist, I struck gold I got the best dentist he was so good and I got all the dental work I needed done to the point where I was going every 6 months for a check up. He went from doing NHS (that's me) to only doing private, I couldn't afford to stay with him, and was put with the man that took over from him. He was dreadful and I ended up being neglected by him, through this and being terrified of going, I forced myself shaking and being in total panic mode to go.

The outcome of this story is I went on numerous occasions and said something was wrong and he was not listening and did nothing. I actually had an abscess untreated for months. I stopped going because he made me feel like a pest, when I should have persisted.

My tooth broke last year I was too terrified to go see him and had to get another dentist. I was in the same state as you are at the moment.

The moral of this tale is if you don't feel comfortable with your dentist and you feel like you are going backwards and getting worked up and phobic, I would send an e mail telling the dentist that as good as he is, and you know he is doing everything to make you feel better, but that you need what you have explained on here. That way you give him a chance, because he does sound like he cares.

If he doesn't respond and you feel the same, then find another dentist. But this dentist sounds like he would be willing to give it a go.

You've nothing to lose, don't leave it how it is or you will end up in my position either not going or not being honest with him, either way you suffer. It's not worth it when you have come this far.

I forgot to add I now have a fantastic dentist that ticks all the boxes and my mouth is getting sorted out, and my mental state is very good as well, not stressing about things now and not getting in a panic about my mouth.

GOOD LUCK. I wish you well.
 
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Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

The appointment's tomorrow, and I'm panicking now! :scared:

After thinking it through I decided email would probably be the best option, but by then it was too late (would've had to send it on Friday really). So I think I'm going to have to try to talk to him tomorrow. But, to be honest, the thought of that is as scary, if not more so, than the treatment itself - at least I get to be sedated for that...unfortunately I can't really ask him to sedate me so that I'm calm enough to talk! :rolleyes:

Actually, I've also found the thought of being sedated isn't as comforting as usual. I think it's because I keep remembering how I felt when I was trying to resist them when they were taking impressions last time, and I couldn't stop them...it's only a short and hazy memory, but what I remember is trying ot fend them off but giving in because I had no energy to fight, feeling alone and helpless, and crying a bit while they did it. They weren't rough or nasty or anything, and impressions are my worst thing, so I don't think there'll be a repeat performance tomorrow. But I think it's had quite an impact on the whole trust/feeling safe thing. What I want to do is ask him what he thinks happened (I can't really remember immediately before or after that moment, just when he tried to/did put it in), and work out how to make sure it doesn't happen again...but, of course, that involves talking! :rolleyes: :censored:

As I'm writing this, I now think what would really help would be to talk to him, but in a separate appointment. That way, I'd know I wasn't holding him up by talking. I'd also be so much calmer, without the fight/flight thing going on; I'd still have the anxiety about embarrassment etc, but I wouldn't have one mind on panicking about what's to come, and there wouldn't be so much riding on the conversation (i.e. if it did go badly, I'd just be leaving afterwards, not having to let him treat me anyway). Maybe we could even talk not in a dentist's room, which would help even more. Only problem is, even if they let me do this, it can't happen before tomorrow! I guess at least it's helpful to know for the future....

Right now, I'm just constantly anxious. :( I've an additional worry because I'm meant to be singing in a concert on Tuesday, and last time I could barely move my mouth the next day! But I'm hoping that shouldn't happen this time? I've got some major non-dental stresses going on too. A positive experience tomorrow would mean so much.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Hugs..hope you're sleeping now.
Tomorrow will be OK. You're a strong lady.
Remember: they're only "words". They won't hurt when you speak them!!!!
Best wishes.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Thank you, mghstl. You have a way of making me feel better! :) I'll take your encouragement in with me tomorrow. Hope I find the words to say and the courage to speak. And yes, I should be in bed, but I'm not! (Anxiety wrecks my sleep patterns.) About to go now though, I promise!
 
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Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Just discovered this thread: https://www.dentalfearcentral.org/forum/threads/what-would-you-like.1153/ . Found it really helpful to read others articulating exactly what it is I'm struggling to cope without at the moment, and reassuring to know I'm not unusual to feel I need it. All these things could've been written by me this week:
  • "When talking to a patient, even if you think they know it already or you think you're repeating yourself, go over everything that they need to know including answers to commonly asked questions. I realise that dentists aren't mind readers but some people find it very difficult or impossible to speak, let alone ask questions. I've lost count of the number of times I've sat there with loads of questions in my head but I haven't been able to speak due to complete terror. "
  • "Knowing I'm not bad or strange: every time I've been to my dentist, I get the strong impression that this is the normal way he practises. So I'm not a saddo phobic but a person in my own right, and the attitudes my dentist has don't have to be altered because it's me he's seeing. "
  • "Positive reinforcement (i. e. praise for even the smallest baby steps) is another biggie, I think. Really major, for me anyways. Then again, I like a frequent pat on the back :)"
  • "A little reassurance goes a long way.....a gentle pat on the back, or a reassuring rub of the shoulder really helps to calm me down." "Constant reassurance....Just a constant stream of "nearly there" and "are you okay?" and "you're doing really well" and "not long now, last bit" works wonders."
  • "She communicates to me every step of treatment and warns me about anything that might 'alarm' me before she does it, so there aren't any surprises...even if it's just a spray of water to rinse or some small sensation...that can really catch a person off gaurd if they are already nervous! being nervous heightens your senses...VERY IMPORTANT!!!!"
  • "She is incredibly perceptive! I'm not saying that you have to be a mind-reader...all I'm saying is pay attention to word choice, body language, etc...my dentist can always seem to tell by the look on my face and the body language I'm giving off when I'm about to have a 'fight or flight' reaction, and then is able to address it early, before the anxiety gets too out of control. If they flinch or if their lips quiver (like mine do lol) or if they jump or look startled by something, stop and make sure they are ok, and reassure them that your not doing anything that they need to feel frightened by or scared of. "I like when you acknowledge and address my reactions (even a small flinch or startle). It shows that you are paying attention and are genuinely interested and "tuned-in" to my comfort level. "
  • "She doesn't treat me like I'm crazy for having my fears. She respects them and understands that some people get nervous and it's a normal reaction on some level and every person has their reasons for their fears and she validates them and is sympathetic and patient towards them. Seeing her validate my fears and respect them really opens the communication and trust levels cause it eliminates that fear or shame of being judged and eliminating the need to hide my fear which just makes me more anxious. She usually treats nervousness like something she sees everyday which is nice cause then I feel a little more normal and I guess it just creates a more comforting environment."
  • "the dental nurse is also very important. Mine kept squeezing my hand and asking me if I was ok, speaking to me by name and asking me if I was ok every 10 minutes or so. It made a world of difference to me as I felt she was keeping an eye on me and would know if I needed a break or anything else. She never let me get to that panicked stage!"
I don't know if this helps or hinders me practically - it guides what I could try to say to him tomorrow, but it also makes me wonder whether I need to find someone who just does all this stuff already, without me needing to ask. :( But I do feel better for having read it.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Considering that my degree is in Speech Communication, yet I turn into a quivering mass of jelly if I have to speak in a situation I feel to be "confrontational"...I shouldn't be doling out advice!
I can ramble on forever to a crowd, but I have a he!! of a time expressing anything personal to a superior being, i.e. DENTIST.
Hope you put your thoughts onto paper and take them with you.
Write it down and read it to your dentist.
And GOOD LUCK!!!!
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

If your appointment is tomorrow could you not e mail the dentist today and let them know how you feel.

If not I wish you all the best for tomorrow.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Actually, I've also found the thought of being sedated isn't as comforting as usual. I think it's because I keep remembering how I felt when I was trying to resist them when they were taking impressions last time, and I couldn't stop them...it's only a short and hazy memory, but what I remember is trying ot fend them off but giving in because I had no energy to fight, feeling alone and helpless, and crying a bit while they did it.

I found this interesting, as I know that being partially sedated would make me much worse than coping with the panicky feelings. I don't like feeling 'out of it', either from alcoholic drink or any types of drugs, so maybe you have reached a point where you would like to find a way around it without being sedated ?
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

mghstl - thanks...again. Yes, I always write down what I need to ask/say before appointments; unfortunately I don't always go through with it! :rolleyes: I've been rehearsing today's speech over and over - hope I can get at least some of it out!

Carole - my appointment is today, in about 1 hour! :o I was up very late, hence tomorrow being today...if you know what I mean! o_O Sorry for the confusion!

Carys - so far I have LOVED sedation! :-* My phobia is kind of hard to explain, but it's basically of mouths, and I hate having anything done in mine, even brushing my own teeth! The sedation makes me drowsy enough hardly to care about all this stuff that would normally make me panic/sick, it helps stop me gagging (which would be a major feeder into the anxious/sick feeling), and I get to walk out with hardly any mouth-y memories to have to try and forget! ;D I don't think I could ever have got through my appointments without it. But if I don't trust my dentist or feel safe, then giving up control becomes scary. In that case, though, I'd ditch the dentist, not the sedation! :p Right now, trusting this dentist is a work-in-progress - so the thought of being sedated today is still a relief, but there are just those little seeds of doubt in there too (seeds made bigger by experiences like last time!).

Anyway, I need to get on...time to leave soon...:hidesbehindsofa:
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

I don't know if this helps or hinders me practically - it guides what I could try to say to him tomorrow, but it also makes me wonder whether I need to find someone who just does all this stuff already, without me needing to ask. :( But I do feel better for having read it.

I have much the same problem. I could talk for England most of the time... apart from when I'm at the dentist's! The minute I step through the door, I go from being fairly easy going and talkative, into a quivering, nervous wreck who can't really say much apart from directly answering questions if they ask me. What's even worse, is that I shake like a leaf and my lips have a nasty habit of trembling/twitching when I'm in the chair and no matter what I do, it won't stop :redface:. I felt a right fool at my appointment last week as my bottom lip felt like it was jiggling away and had a mind of it's own whilst I had one of my teeth filed down. I'm sure dentists probably see that sort of thing everyday, it's just that it doesn't feel that way to us when it's happening.

There may well be a dentist out there who instinctively just knows what you need to help you feel calmer, but the thing is, that everyone is different, so what works for one patient might not work for another. Most dentists have some idea of what might help, but they can't know for sure unless you tell them.

A couple of years ago, I realised that if I was going to get anywhere, I needed to tell my dentist, what I needed to know or happen in order for me to start overcoming my fears. I couldn't bring myself to say it and although he was really nice and patient, I felt really bad about taking up too much of his time (I was an NHS patient at the time). In the end, I got so frustrated with myself for not being able to say anything, that I typed it out on a couple of sheets of paper and handed it over at my next appointment. He'd told me that I needed a filling and so after he'd done the injection and before I went back into the waiting room, I just pulled it out of my bag and said "Oh, you might as well read this. It should explain everything" as if it was nothing out of the ordinary. The next 20 minutes were awful and I very nearly left because I was worried about how he'd react when I went back in for the filling. When I was called back in, he never mentioned the letter but did exactly what I'd asked him to, was generally quite relaxed about everything and things were a lot better for me (and probably for him too).

I put a bit about the background to my fears, what I was scared of now and what might help. It started off something like "You're probably wondering why I've just given you a piece of paper instead of telling you what's wrong. The problem is that if I'm anxious (or more likely right now, terrified!), I either talk complete rubbish or develop a stammer, so I thought it would be easier if I typed it instead...".

Writing it down took the pressure off having to get 'the speech' right because I didn't have to say anything, I just handed it over. Also, handing a note to him at your appointment, will give him a message that he needs to give you a bit more time in order to address your fears and concerns.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Vicky what a good read this was it could have been me that wrote this. I also sent my dentist a note both to say thank you for his patience and consideration, and to explain a bit about why I was nervous, bit by bit he is getting a full story of why I am phobic/nervous.

Pianimo, I think by now you are at the dentist or have just been, I thought it was today Monday that was the appointment.

Hope it went how you wanted and that you have had done what you needed to get done. I look forward to hearing how you went on later.

All the best
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

I want nothing more tonight then hearing that you are happy with today's events!
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Right, here comes the report! Sorry for the delay - I deliberately didn't post the same day because I've learned from experience that sedation tends to leave me feeling like the world's about to end, so I don't have the best perspective! And the last few days I've been caught in busyness and illness. But I'm sorry to keep you waiting.

So................wait for it...................................it went well! :) Yay! That's the short version...here's this detail! [This:
I could talk for England most of the time... apart from when I'm at the dentist's!
is definitely true of me too (well, dentist and a few other places), as I'm sure my posts here demonstrate! :redface:]

Well, first off he was friendly when I went in, and seemed to make more small talk than normal, which I find helpful. I asked him exactly what was going to happen today, and what to expect afterwards, and he explained...not in as much detail as I would've liked, but clearly and kindly. I then asked him about paying for the sedation - my treatment plan only included one session of it, but he'd said I could have it that day too, so I'd asked to pay at reception on my way in, since you can't pay after sedation. They'd just said to leave it and we'd sort it later if necessary. He told me I didn't need to pay - something about it not taking much more to have it (I struggle to take much in when I'm anxious!), and he really wants decisions about sedation to be based on need, not cost. That meant a lot to me, in letting me start to believe he really does want to help me

Then it was time for my 'speech'...I was terrified, but I was holding on to everything peple have said on here, plus what he'd just said made me a bit less scared about his reaction. I just said that it would really help me if he talked a bit more, and let me know exactly what to expect before it happened. He just said "Ok". I then mentioned that I knew I'd got upset last time. He said it shouldn't happen again, since it was the impressions that caused it, and I agreed. He said they'd used the smallest tray possible, so that made me feel he'd tried to help. Also, the way he talked about it made me feel reassured that he wasn't annoyed with me about it, and that's a huge deal for me to know that.

I then took the plunge again, and said if I did get upset again, that talking to me/reassuring me will help - not to worry about patronising me, he should just treat me like a kid! He just smiled/laughed a bit and said "Ok" again. I was really embarassed and felt I probably hadn't explained myself very well, but I was proud of myself for saying something at all!

Then came the treatment itself. Now, because this was a shorter appointment than I've had before, my memory is hazier of the during and the immediately after. At best I can remember remembering things....if you know what I mean?! o_O But I think he did talk to me and reassure me more...I think he said "You're doing really well" at one point, but I can't remember it now, so I'm not sure! I do know I felt so much happier afterwards than last time. My dad says I came out looking almost happy, whereas last time when I came out it was obvious I'd just been crying. He said my dentist looked happier this time, too! :rolleyes:

If I compare this dentist to my 'ideal' (or my old dentist), he's still just not that person. But on Monday, for the first time, I started to feel 'safe' with him, to feel I could relax and let my guard down just that tiny bit. It's a small step, but I'd felt like it was impossible, and that's what had scared/upset me so much last week; so, it's a small step that makes a big difference. This was the first time I'd walked out of the building and not just wished I never had to come back.

Which leads on to the only real negative part of the day, mixed in with a huge positive I'd somehow forgotten about...that appointment was the end of my treatment!!!! That's it! Somehow I hadn't quite twigged that was the case, so it's weird thinking about it now - but it's true: I wanted a healthy mouth, and now I've got one!! :jump: So, it's "See you in six months!"....except, he didn't say that! He never mentioned anything about booking another appointment, so now I don't know what to do and I'm worrying again about what he's thinking. I asked the nurse manning the recovery room, and she said "Oh, your treatment's over, so I guess you'll just need to see him in about six months". But I don't know what he expects.

Added into this, I'd planned/hoped to find a place to settle and join a membership plan or Denplan. But I'm still getting to know this dentist (though Monday was a huge stride forward), and I don't know if he wants me as a regular patient either! (That's probably an irrational fear, but it's very real; in my head I feel like if he'd wanted or expected to see me again, he would've said so.) I'd also want to find a hygienist I'm happy with too, and I'm not sure how to go about that - if I need to pick one now, I'd have to base it on just talking to him/her, since I'm obviously not going to pay for another cleaning when I've just had one! I guess I could wait six months, see him again and try out a hygienist, then decide...although, if I don't like that hygienist, trying a new one every six months could be a very long process! :rolleyes: This is all hard for me because I hate uncertainty and struggle to cope with it, so I just want this sorted.

However, all that aside, I'm so much happier than I was this time last week! And a huge part of that is thanks to you guys - I was really tempted to chicken out of saying anything, and remembering your advice, knowing I had people 'rooting' for me, and knowing I had your support to come back to no matter how this went all helped me not to. So, thank you!

You know, I noticed the effect this site has had on me in another way on Monday - when I was in the recovery room, another girl was in there with her family after an extraction, and apparently (I can only remember some of it) I was answering all her questions and giving advice on what to do/not to do after sedation, and after extractions (the latter must've come mainly from what I've picked up on here!). All this whilst quite obviously holding my hand over my eyes and looking down/away from her, since she had a bowl and was dribbling/spitting a lot! :sick: lol Now, trying to help anyone and everyone is normal for me, but having dental knowledge in my head, let alone being able to talk about it, is not! So that's one phobia barrier my time on DFC has slowly been breaking down. I can even read most posts now without feeling sick...maybe I really have come a long way! :)

Well, this post seems suitably long enough to make up for its lateness, don't you think?! :p Seriously, thanks to those who have borne with me and read it all!
 
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Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

YIIPPPEEEE!!!!!
Awesome, awesome job! I am so pleased that YOU are pleased.
If you are looking for "suggestions" on what to do next....may I suggest a short note or email to your dentist, letting him know about the good things he did and how much you appreciate it, then asking about his recommendation for the next step. I really liked going back three months after my treatment ended...it was a chance to reconnect, to be complimented on my progress, to not let the phobia-monster get his claws back in me, and to truly confirm that I was "done".
Wine glass raised!!!
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Excellent, I'm very proud of you. I'm a bit too tired to type a longer response but I think maybe nuf said.

Xept, dentist here fight to keep their patients......and so do medical docs. We are customers..and the market is very competitive. I want you to work on that concept next

:XXLhug:

rp
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Gosh, my last post really was long, wasn't it?! :redface:

Thanks you two - really helpful stuff, as usual!

RP - I hadn't thought about that at all. Seriously, now you've mentioned it, I've realised that in the back of my mind somewhere I've carried this idea of dentists receiving a set salary from their practice, unrelated to the number of patients they personally treat etc...for some reason I've just never actually thought this through! :rolleyes: I mean, I know about dentists getting more money for doing more treatment etc, and I've read so many posts on here about dentists and money and patients...yet somehow the whole concept still managed to pass me by!!! o_O Hmmm.

My head has now adapted its argument accordingly: "You're too difficult a patient to be worth the money!" Duly working on getting my head around the main idea, anyway.
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

So, my head is now swimming with questions about the inner workings of a private dental practice! :hmm: How much of the money I hand over actually goes to my dentist? Where does the money come from to pay those who are salaried - nurses, recpetionists? (...hygienists? Or do they earn more in the way dentists do?) Whose responsibility is it to find patients for a new dentist - them, or the practice? In the meantime, do they just earn no money?! What's the difference between a partner and an associate in terms of how they are paid? ....And so on....

None of which is the main point, I know, but my curiosity has now been piqued! :rolleyes: lol Probably doesn't help that I have no business knowledge whatsoever! o_O
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

I work in a private practice for another healthcare field in the US. Here, I imagine it would work like this: the dentist (who owns the practice, either solely or with partners), hygienist and anyone performing actual services for patients are the ones whose services bring money into the practice through ayments from clients and insurance reimbursements. Add to that money earned through grants, consultations, seminars, tax breaks/write-offs and other partnerships like product endorsements. Subtract money for office space, utilities, supplies, insurance, advertising/marketing and salaries for the office staff, associates (providers but not owners, but more like employees of the dentist) and the dentist etc.
Sounds like a great thing, to have your own business like that!
 
Re: Tomorrow! (Here we go again...)

Interesting...thanks for that mjg! They do do rather well for themselves, don't they?! :rolleyes: I'm not sure how it works in the UK - having now actually thought it through (!), I think that possibly all dentists may be techinically self-employed, even associates. Certainly that's the case with NHS, I think? The only salaried posts would be like in hospitals or the army etc. But I could be wrong? o_O

One thought occurred to me they other day: at my first treatment appointment with this dentist I asked him if I could listen to my mp3 player. He agreed as long as I kept it quiet enough to hear instructions, and I said that's what I'd meant, becuase I wanted to know what was going on anyway. But I'm wondering if it's possible he thought the fact I wanted my music on meant I didn't want him to say very much? So he may actually have been deliberately talking less... :rolleyes: Now that would be irony. I guess we're back to the same ol' mantra: communication, communication, communication!
 
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