Anyone else ever ABUSED "in the chair"?

[notnumbenuff]

Hi...I'm new. But not new to dental office fear.

I read a little bit about child abuse, and dental fear because of that, and yes, I was abused as a child, sexual and emotionally and physically.

But...the abuse that left me with fear of going to the dentist happened on my first trip to the dentist...in the chair. My parents had gone to this dentist forever, but I was 7 and it was my first time.

I was abused emotionally and physically in the dental chair by the dentist's wife who was his office manager and assistant. My parents were not allowed back into the exam room with me; they were made to wait in the lobby waiting room. I wasn't afraid to go in alone. I didn't know I needed to be... and was excited to be there. I was not an unruly child; I was a "pleaser". And, never met a stranger.

When the dentist was in the room with the assistant and me, his wife treated me like a princess. As soon as he would leave the room to "room hop" to another patient, she would abuse me. I was pinched very hard on my arms and legs, had my hair pulled, she held her hand up as if to slap my face, and threatened if I made a sound that she would hurt me.

The dentist would stop back in to check how things were and this monster would make comments like "What beautiful eyes and long lashes you have darling!" "You have such a nice ponytail...thick, long beautiful...".

He would leave again and the torture would begin again. "Don't you dare cry or make a noise. My kids love to sit in this chair."

He would come in again and the sweet remarks began again. "Oh...she just said the funniest thing....I asked her what that tasted like, and she said 'hair spray'...!"

I am sure the kind man thought the fear on my face and wide eyes were dental fear.....but it was fear of her.....not pain. I have a high pain tolerance.

In the lobby, she was all smiles for my parents...and told me how happy she would be to see me next time.

I made it out the door before I burst into tears and managed to stutter..."SHE PINCHED ME! HARD!"

My parents questioned me outside and my Dad wanted to go back in and I screamed and begged them not to. I feared for my life. We went home and I was questioned over and over. My grnadparents offered me money to go and tell the dentist what happened.

I overheard the grownups talking that things were fine until this "wife"....a 2nd wife at that, had became his assistant and the normal staff left. That the wife was very jealous and had intercoms installed in the rooms so she could hear the conversation the dentist had with female patients.

This was in 1957, folks...yes...I'm 60 years old.

The conclusion was that the dentist would not take a child's word over that of his wife's. Nothing was ever done. My parents stopped going to that dentist. A few years later, he was no longer in practice.

I am positive that I was not the only child tortured by this sick woman. Probably some child was brave enough to tell their parents and their parents acted to stop this.

Has any one else ever been abused in the chair?

I put off going to the dentist because of it. I go for years without seeing one.

And...I also have the issue that I can't stay numb with injections because of the nerve structure in my mouth. I have been injected as many as a dozen times for a simple filling procedure. The doc says that I "burn the anesthesia too fast".

The abuse fear is an issue, the not numb enough is an issue, and I have had a triple heart bypass (6 years ago), and it is difficult to have someone agree to do oral surgery on me because they want a signed form from my Cardiologist saying I will be okay, and they won't give that okay....no one knows when a simple surgery can take a wrong turn and cause an outcome of death. So they play the "CYA" game and I get left in the middle. I found a solution last time in order to have a tooth removed because it was infecting the bone....(2 root canals didn't work....file left in there....needed oral, and couldn't get the forms signed.).

(Heard of back door abortions? I had a back door oral extraction by a doc who had a CABG 2 months prior to agreeing to do mine....he knew what I faced in getting treatment and didn't ask for a form to be signed to do it.) But he's older than I am and a CABG patient too.....what if he's not around next time I need it done?

It's been 5 years, and I'm long overdue for a cleaning and other dental work. But it's such an issue...I keep putting it off.

I need to find a good dentist who won't leave a file in a root canal, and who can get me numb enough to do a filling, and who will treat me without a Cardiologist signing off on it.

I live in the Dallas-Fort Worth area. Any suggestions for a good place to turn?

notnumbenuff would appreciate any help.

 

[GrahamDee]

Wow! This is really disturbing reading.

Its no wonder people have dental phobias after this. Treatment and abuse like this can emotionally scar people for life and keep them from treatment, which can affect them for the rest of their life.

I can't say I've had anything like this, but I've had my share of torture and abuse which was enough to rewire my brain against dentists.

My dentist when I was a kid was this weazely guy who encouraged kids to look after thier teeth by shouting abuse and humiliation in front of everyone (staff, other patients and parents) and if that wasn't enough I had extractions under gas where i was physically held and sufficated unconcious (hand held over mouth with an already blocked nose) until I passed out and then slapped awake and again shouted at for being difficult and 'bad'. That was more than enough for me not to want to go to dentists again, only forcing myself when things got to the toothache stage.

All that is still with me and it took many years to gradually get over, but even now, I cannot have teeth extracted, due to an indelble and phsycological terror of having them pulled. I have to pay the money and undergo IV sedation to have them out (had one done only a few weeks ago), else they are staying put. No question. Not negotiable. That in itself has forced me into the dentists chair in an attempt to keep my teeth up together to avoid ever having to undergo it again.

I can't help with the numbing issue, but I hope you can find someone who can help you. Abuse in any form can leave a stain on your life which may stay with you always. But it is possible to overcome it or at least partially overcome it sufficently so you can get some work done. Confidence is the key here and establishing a level of trust that the dentist is not going to hurt you, much less abuse you. So you need to see a dentist who will take some time and listen to all your experiences and fears before doing anything. If you can't speak to a dentist, write to them.

One thing I have learnt is that dentists should have your welfare at the top of their priorities. A happier, confident patient is an easier one to work on than one who resists and is basically terrified -which is why stuff like IV and nitrous is really popular I guess.

I know I will never overcome my fears to the point of allowing extractions, but I can tolerate anything else they do such as root work, fillings etc and for now, that is good enough for me. I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it is possible to overcome this, it just takes a lot of time, effort and a good dentist to do this.

Hang in there, you can overcome your abuse and I hope you can get the treatment you need.

 

[notnumbenuff]

Thank you so much for taking the time to read and reply. It seems the chair and your dentist created a torture chamber of your own to deal with and have to overcome. So you know where I'm coming from in even attempting to find a new dentist.

I don't want a file ever left in during a root canal procedure again; so I need someone competent. And I need some one who is competent enough to deal with injections or whatever necessary to safely get me numb enough.

I've been through enough medical surgeries that I have a high pain tolerance, but when it comes to nerves in the mouth....I need help.

I go into the chair with a wad of tissues in both hands to absorb the sweaty palms....

The memory of abuse never goes away. I just wondered if anyone else had it happen in the chair.

Glad to have found the forum. Will need to learn to navigate it better. With enough reading, maybe I can pick up the phone and start finding a dentist to help me. I just so dread going through the process, but dental health is also heart health, and I need to do all I can to live out the 2nd chance at life that my triple heart bypass gave me.

 

[brit]

HI notnumbenuff
Thanks for sharing your history. I was waiting for someone else to comment first and I'm glad Graham obliged.
I would say what you described is extremely unusual since it wasn't the dentist doing the abuse but another party working alongside them who then faked niceness in front of the other adults. It doesn't seem to have specifically related to the dental environment - or was she carrying out dental tasks as well?.
Actually in the 1960s the husband of one of my teacher's forced me to eat a hard ginger biscuit and other adults were also in the room and it was after school - he approached me from behind, held my nose and forced me to crunch down this hard biscuit and I simply did not really understand what he was doing or why...it only happened the once.

Judging from posts we get, it does happen (although still rarely) for posters to say dentists who have hurt them physically during dental treatment have also initiated sexual type abuse (inappropriate touching etc) whilst they are in the chair; there are cases were the treatment is ok but sexual abuse is initiated (even rarer); and probably the most common kind of dental abuse (which I believed I once experienced over two hour long visits) where the dentist would then be a sadist maybe deriving sexual pleasure from causing the vulnerable unaccompanied child patient unnecessary pain. It would be dressed up as 'a degree of concern for the pain caused' such as 'yes that one was a bit deep wasn't it?' but no anaesthetic given.
Funnily enough I moved on from this very quickly, still attended alone but always found it easy to get painfree care after that and promised myself I wouldn't just 'put up and shut up in future' - if I hadn't cooperated and shouted out instead, I'm sure I would have been 'rescued' by the dentist in the next room as their policy was to give LA for everything but I didn't - you trusted and obeyed adults back then and didn't question them directly especially if alone without a parent. I even went back for a second instalment lol and didn't tell my parents what he'd done to me...I did say I wanted to change dentists and they agreed..once course of treatment finished.

In my limited experience this type of dental abuser often has zero chairside manner and are very authoritarian and unsympathetic - that's a good way to spot them - never sit in the dental chair of someone who doesn't at least make an effort to make you feel comfortable - there has to be a degree of interaction/trust.
The only long term effect if has on me is to make me 'really appreciate' dentists who seem happy to see me, treat me as an individual and don't cause me pain....I'll never moan about the treatment process so long as pain is zero and I have control.

You need to find someone competent for sure but also someone who can get their head round the abuse too and make the experience as different as possible. When you meet a new dentist you should ideally have a 'chat' only appointment away from the dental chair. It is possible for you to change how you feel (sweaty palms) but probably only once you have found a dental practitioner you feel safe with...
All the best.
You need one with advanced LA techniques, all teeth can be got numb, but not all dentists can get all teeth numb all the time.
Anxiety could be the reason you are burning the LA off as it were...so relaxation exercises/sedation may be needed to help keep you comfortably numb. If it's anatomical variation, you need to be injected in a different place so that the correct nerves can be reached.

Can't Get Numb

Find out why you may not get numb enough, what dentists can do to get you numb, and how to ensure your treatment is painless.

www.dentalfearcentral.org

Abuse survivors of all kinds often have issues with dentistry that is completely usual - we have some info on it:

Tips for Abuse Survivors and Their Dentists

Tips for survivors of sexual, emotional and physical abuse and their dentists, written by a survivor of childhood abuse.

www.dentalfearcentral.org

 

[notnumbenuff]

Brit, thanks for your suggestions.

Yes, there is anxiety that could be a small part of the numbing issue, but the main problem is that my mouth and jaw is too tiny for the amount of teeth I have. When I was 16, I had to have oral surgery to remove a wisdom tooth that came in....in the wierdest place....the very middle of the upper roof of my mouth. Other teeth grew in misaligned trying to squeeze all those teeth in a small gum/jaw line....was like trying to squeeze the fat lady in a way too small girdle. Things relocated to where they shouldn't be.

At least those are the 2 things the last oral surgeon who corrected the failed root canals with the file left behind by having to extract it....and treat the bone for infecion. He is at a dental school, and I know "a friend in high places " there. That's how I got it done without the consent form the oral surgeion I was referred to being signed. The specialist I was referred to demanded that my Cardio guy sign a release form for me to have the oral surger, and the Cardio guy wouldn't sign it. So someone pulled some strings for me, and this one oral surgeon, who had himself had a triple bypass only 2 months prior to him doing my surgery did it. He, because of his own CABG, knew what I was up against in the CYA tug of war over the signed release by the heart doc.

But that oral surgeon is older than I, and that was 5 years ago. Whether or not he is still practicing, I don't know. For now, I just need a dentist who understands how to numb me up enough to do basic dental work needed.

And I do have "the talk" with each new dentist, and all I get is a confused, disbelieving look, when I explain that I don't get numb enough. Evidently that is an advanced course in dental school not required of all dentist? I don't know that for sure, but it's a guess since I've had an issue all my life with that from every dentist I've garnered the nerve to try.

I may just have to go back to my friend "in high places" at the school and request aid again. I hate to....because they are not on the provider list of my dental insurance.

But...it's been 5 years since even a check up, and I need to stop putting it off.

And the doctor's wife was his assistant as well as office manager. As you said, back then you did as told by adults....you didn't dispute their word, or question their actions. Children were to be seen and not heard. She was just a sick woman. This happened in Fort Worth, Texas back in the '50's. I wonder how many others she did this to.....I can't believe I was her only victim.

The doctor himself was very nice. My parents had been really pleased with him for years for themselves. Back then, people just didn't confront on a child's word. People didn't sue. You just took your business elsewhere.

When the doctor closed his practice several years later....I wondered if someone did confront him and the issue was brought to the surface, or if he just lost all his business because of her. I actually checked each new phone book delivered to see if he was still there for years afterward until his name was no longer there.

Again, I appreciate your response.

 

[brit]

And I do have "the talk" with each new dentist, and all I get is a confused, disbelieving look, when I explain that I don't get numb enough. Evidently that is an advanced course in dental school not required of all dentist? I don't know that for sure, but it's a guess since I've had an issue all my life with that from every dentist I've garnered the nerve to try.

Unfortunately you are not wrong here - the advanced techniques are not necessarily taught at Dental School so I am told. The people who do pick them up tend to be oral surgeons and dentists who care and go out of their way to learn more - there's a textbook by Stanley Malamed on the subject of local anaesthesia in dentistry.
Any dentist who gives you 'that look', will not work out, you need the one who goes 'oh yes, anatomical variation, yes I have that myself....etc etc ...we need to do an x-ray and work out where the nerve is to that tooth so we can inject in the right place'
Block injections have a high failure rate anyway even in people without anatomical variations..

Countless posters on here, have experiences where dentists have failed to get their teeth sufficiently numb supposedly because of infection present...again there are dentists who know the advanced techniques for doing this, countless posters have endured insufficient anaesthesia because a dentist has re-injected in exactly the same place and not tried sth different..

so ...all I can suggest is that you ask nosey questions upfront about knowledge of advanced techniques (Cow Gates, Akinosi, PDL, Stabident, X-tip, etc etc ) before even wasting your time with a consult.

The computer controlled delivery systems of LA such as Compudent's single tooth anaesthesia/TheWand would probably also work in your case...so long as they can identify where the particular nerve is serving a particular tooth so it can be numbed.

Don't let anyone continue to work on you if you are not numb would also be another good rule of thumb as, as you know many will happily continue unless you withdraw your consent.

Good luck it's an awful problem to have.

 

[gold crown]

Talk about abuse I had the wrong tooth extracted and ended up with a severed lingual nerve. I was not at a dental school where a bunch students were learning to become dentists. No i was at a general dentist who had been a dentist for 15 years and had a track record with the ADB that finally cost them their license. I can not imagine getting a numbing shot for a filling anymore due to the risk of injectional nerve damage.

 

[Requiem]

Oh wow...That's terrible! I'm sorry to hear that you got stuck with a dentist like that. As I was growing up I was stuck with a dentist that had purposely missed a cavity I had, and waited until it was almost a root canal.

One of the worse experiences I have had at a dentists office is I had to have a tooth pulled that was still one of my baby teeth. They numbed me up and stuff, but I could still feel the pain perfectly well. It got to the point where I was shouting that it hurt over and over. But my dentist yelled to me "Hold still!" and threatened to slap me. I had to deal with feeling the tooth being pulled out without much numbing medication...It was terrible.

 

[kittykat]

I have been abused as well, and mine is a bit more serious. I was put under anesthesia when I was 4 and raped by the dentist. I woke up while it was happening. Old thread, but still relevant.

 

[Frida]

When i was around 5 or 6.... While getting a cavity filled the dentist pinch, squeezed and smacked my face. Thanks to him i no longer trust dentists.

 

[iDent]

Welcome, Notnumbenuff! I thought my first childhood dental office was bad, but yours was worse. . .

Although I am not a medical professional, I have worked in an academic medical center with cardiologists for several years. In addition, my dentist is an adjunct faculty member at the local dental school.

I think you should consider going to a dentist who is a part-time faculty member at the highly-rated Texas A & M/Baylor College of Dentistry in Dallas. Unlike the full-time faculty dentists, who may only see patients in teaching dental clinics in collaboration with dental students, the part-time faculty dentists have private practices. By seeing a part-time faculty dentist, you will have a dentist who is comfortable treating patients with medical conditions like heart disease (and should also be accustomed to working with odontophobes) while avoiding dealing with dentists in training, an idea that makes many dental phobics wary: https://dentistry.tamhsc.edu/general-dentistry/contacts.html

I hope this helps! Please keep us posted.

 

[pinyonjay2]

@notnumbenuff: That's horrific to hear what you went through, and the others on this thread too. : ( My experience is most similar to Frida's. When I was around 7 or 8, they gave me nitrous oxide for me to get a few cavity fillings. The dentist had me tilted way too far back in the chair, to the point that I felt like I was going to slide out of it...and in fact, I'm positive that I did at one point and they had to pull me up. I was really out of it from the nitrous so I only remember bits and pieces, but the most horrifying memory that has stuck with me for years (I'm almost 24 now), is that I felt some water go down the wrong way and started coughing. Of course, I panicked and flailed around. The dentist forcibly held my arms down and said rude things. (Can't remember what they were though.) But I was in a full out panic and convinced I was going to die...that they'd force more water down my throat and suffocate me...

Another time, this wasn't really abuse, but I panicked and hit one of the instruments out of the assistant's hand and she was cursing about how I "broke it". I know I was a lot younger but I don't remember how old I was back then.

Thanks to that horrific child dentist, I have a mind-numbing fear of laying on my back in the dentist's chair for anything that's not a routine cleaning (but for the actual polishing, I HAVE to be sitting up and rinse my mouth out while sitting up, or better yet, in the sink). I'm also petrified of getting another cavity and take immensely good care of my teeth because of this incident.