First post - history and need help

[finney]

I'm "finney", 30 years old, female, pretty good health, actually including dental issues.

I guess the first thing I should do is give some background. My baby teeth were pretty uneventful, I had a few cavities, nothing big. The problems didn't start until my permanent teeth starting coming in. My teeth were severely crowded and it was known pretty early on that I was going to need braces. Also not a big deal. Not something kids look forward to, but pretty standard stuff.

However...I was born in 1977. Do the math. It was about 1985 when the problems first started. "Back then" the dentists, or at least MY dentist, still thought serial extractions would solve the problems...pull the teeth in the right order to make room for the permanent teeth and easy fix, right? Wrong. Still, I ended up going in to the dentist every 2-4 months just to have more teeth pulled. It would be anywhere from 1 to 6 being the most. I don't remember the extractions themselves being too horrible, it was after. Blood and pain and no pain medication and not being able to eat for a week. Still somehow I survived that.

Then came the braces. I had a really severe overbite so I couldn't get all my brackets at once...I'd just bite them off right away. I think I started with 6 or 8 on the top teeth. A little sore, again nothing too major. Well, my mom (was was never my ally, let's just leave that situation at that) said that it was "taking too long" and to put the rest on. Yeah, well, that didn't work so well. I got them on on Friday afternoon, was at my Dad's on Sunday crying, screaming, and puking. Too much, too fast, too tight. So my dad called my ever-so-friendly childhood dentist, who did NOT want to be bothered with an emergency call, obviously, who forcibly tore half the brackets off my already screaming lower teeth with no anesthesia. I passed out once and vomited 3 times from the pain.

Gee...you think that's where the phobia started? Yeah, maybe.

Fast forward to when I'm about 19. Go in for a normal checkup, get x-rays, long story shorter, turns out I have something called an internal resporbtion. For those here that don't know what that is, the immune system attacks a tooth's pulp and eats it from the inside. The outside of the tooth is fine, the inside is rotting. And it's caused by, guess what, TRAUMA 9 times out of 10. Anyway, dentist tells me that root canals usually fail for that and my best bet is to see an endodontist and get it extracted. For the low low price of $600.

I was 19. I had a job that paid $6.50/hr. I explained that to him and he said he wouldn't do the extraction because the tooth could break. I said well, then I guess that's that and went home.

Go back for a checkup a year later. Dentist yells because the tooth is still in there and I tell him well, what did you expect? I told you I couldn't go to an endodontist. I looked into it, and with the consultation and everything this extraction for one lousy tooth would have cost me over $1500. Once the dentist sees he really isn't going to get the kick back $$$ for the referral all of a sudden he can do the extraction. And that to boot!

He sets everything up. Starts to go to work. Nothing too out of the ordinary happens until the Novacaine wears off! I raise my hand like he tells me too if something was wrong and he asks what it is and I tell him. He says "Well, we're almost done, can you just !!!!!gut it out!!!!" I say well no, not really, and he says, well, it's going to cost another $80 to give you another shot and I'm not confident in your ability to pay.

Last half hour of the extraction was old fashioned white-knuckle dentistry.

Wake up that night in agony. Again long story shorter, find out that all the ligaments in my jaw were hyperextended and now I deal with permanent TMJD which flares up, you guessed it...when I go to the dentist. My mouth does not want to be open for that long.

Eventually borrow money from my dad to get a bridge. Which broke 4 months later. I chipped the fake tooth. The dentist who did it says he'll replace the bridge for free but I can tell you it will be when I'm blue, not breathing, and have no pulse that that happens. Yeah...I really, REALLY want to repeat the most awful medical procedure of my entire life. So far it hasn't broken anymore and the rest of the bridge is sound so as for what I care, it can stay chipped until the put me in the ground.

Then I'm 26 or so. Go to a dif dentist to get a washed out filling replaced. Didn't know this at the time but he was a drunk. He died a year later of liver cancer, actually. The work went OK, but I had to listen to him verbally abuse his dental assistants the entire time. Wasn't that pleasant?

So now here I am, haven't been to the dentist in 4 years or so. Can't really say exactly. Noticed a small cavity in one of my teeth the other day. Really it's nothing major. I'm sure it's just a standard filling. I actually have an apt. on Thursday with a dentist that one of my friends swears to me is nice, funny, and compassionate.

And I'm terrified. I know he's going to yell at me for the stains on my teeth (I drink coffee), for not coming in sooner and "Well you know you wouldn't have these problems if you'd just come in for cleanings". Yeah, that's fantastic and I know that is sound logic but every visit and I do mean EVERY visit to the dentist I have EVER had has been at best unpleasant and at worst traumatic. I know I need to get this small issue fixed while it is still a small issue, but what if he finds another catastrophe like my resorbed tooth? I really can't deal with that again, physically, mentally, or financially.

I don't need a lecture, I don't need to be scolded like a 10 year old, and I know that's what I'm going to get...well, I guess I can't KNOW it, but it's what I've always gotten before, why should this time be any different? I explained to my last dentist (the drunk) what had happened before and that I was really anxious and he said "Well, we all have to face fears". This is not a FEAR...this is something else.

I just don't know how to approach this. Words from the more experienced would be much appreciated.

 

[mikey]

I would advise finding a more caring dentist as a first step.

What Can Help

What can you do to overcome dental phobia? Get information about psychological strategies, new technologies, and sedation.

www.dentalfearcentral.org

 

[finney]

Like I said, I already found a different dentist, but he doesn't do sedation. That's also not an option for me because I have hypotension (low blood pressure) and the few times I have had to have sedation for other minor outpatient surgeries it was under VERY close observation and limited dosages.

 

[mikey]

I'm not really good with large bodies of text...tend to just skim and get the main points...

You could try bringing an mp3 player or an ipod to listen to and distract you from the visit, I find some loud Vanhalen or guns n roses helps drown out the sound. Some people reccomend a blanket cause it may help you feel 'safe' or 'secure' if you will and more comfortable.

 

[finney]

Blanket might be a good idea. Too bad I can't bring my cat. He would be the most comfort of anything I can think of.

Mainly I'm wondering what to say and how not to blow my stack if I get The Lecture. As I said I know it's logical reasoning and won't make sense to people who don't have the same fear but I also don't think that it's anyone's right to castigate someone for being afraid of something - especially when they are clearly trying to overcome it despite fear.

 

[brit]

Hi Finney

My what a history...quite unusual as well because you were born at a time when none of this should have been so traumatic and much of it was caused by orthodontistry or pulling teeth regularly to make room.
Nowadays we'd like to think that the psychological impact of such stuff on children might be taken into account a bit more..presumably it all could have waited a while.

I really do think you are going to be ok with your friend's dentist...she's a good friend right? Personal recommendation is absolutely the best way..I do not think you need sedation...at no point have you mentioned fear of needles or drilling etc etc.
Sedation has its own considerations and downsides such as not actually being properly there in the moment to decide your dentist is actually an ok human being despite the previous ones. You should never go for i/v sedation with someone unless you feel you can trust them..they are the ones charged with keeping you comfortable.

There is no need to assume you will get a lecture either - this is absolutely not supposed to be the norm anymore - you could head this off by stating upfront that you know you should have come in sooner but at least you are here now - and you come highly recommended Doc so please don't let me down or similar.

Remember you are in control of this, particularly if money is not such an issue now you are older...if your friend's dentist doesn't sit comfortably with you, then look elsewhere but given how she has described them, you will probably be fine i.m.v. honestly...defintely worth a try anyway.

Your parents seem to have selected a long stream of uncaring dentists for you and then the drunk...you couldn't make it up,could you? Anywhere where the dentist is abusing the staff is not a place to stay as a patient.
Why not visit the practice in advance and get a feel for the place...this could help put your mind to rest whether you glimpse the doctor or not?
Good luck you can do it and hopefully you won't regret it.Could your friend go along with you maybe and make a personal introduction to the dentist? That would almost guarantee you VIP service. Congratulations for making the appointment so quickly as well(4 years is not that long in the scheme of dental avoidance).

 

[brit]

Mainly I'm wondering what to say and how not to blow my stack if I get The Lecture. As I said I know it's logical reasoning and won't make sense to people who don't have the same fear but I also don't think that it's anyone's right to castigate someone for being afraid of something - especially when they are clearly trying to overcome it despite fear.

Your past dentists do not sound like a very caring friendly bunch at all...it is rare for a decent dentist to give 'the lecture' anymore and even if they do, it probably won't be in quite the same way as you have experienced it before. More likely to be regret that they couldn't have helped you out sooner approach.
Making your customers feel small is not a good way to do business in dentistry or any other field.
You are wrong to think only phobics would object to being spoken to in this way..most people are so into their consumer rights thesedays, they expect doctors to be equal partners in their care and non-judgemental....the exception might be some hygienists but then few patients floss as much as they would like so they are kind of on a broken record...even so - just say...I know I should floss more often...I'll try...end of discussion.

As I said in the other post the best thing is to head them off with self-deprecating comment before they take a look and say...no negative remarks please....I can't turn the clock back but I can deal with the future.
By the way I've even seen dentists advertise 'no lecture'..they are aware of it as an issue. Honestly.

 

[brit]

He sets everything up. Starts to go to work. Nothing too out of the ordinary happens until the Novacaine wears off! I raise my hand like he tells me too if something was wrong and he asks what it is and I tell him. He says "Well, we're almost done, can you just !!!!!gut it out!!!!" I say well no, not really, and he says, well, it's going to cost another $80 to give you another shot and I'm not confident in your ability to pay.

No one has ever mentioned this aspect before to my knowledge...another bad thing you encountered.....paying per shot for anaesthesia...does this really happen in the USA all the time (I'm assuming that's where you are)....surely not for these people with their $$$$$$$ quotes?.
I think I'm right in saying that in the private sector in the UK, you get a quote for a procedure and that includes as much LA as you need...some folks need more, some less ...in any event there is no financial pressure to skimp on anaesthetic...there was definitely never any in the NHS as again it is not charged separately.

I know that in some EU countries LA doses are charged for as extras(scary if you are cash-strapped) but for extractions and other things however much was required would be included in the catch all fee.
It is certainly included where I go, there is no anaesthetic breakdown on the invoice...this is good, you get as much as you need and sod the dentist's profit margin!

 

[scared2bthere]

Finney,
I am so sorry to hear you have gone through all that. Truly it sounds horrible.

Are you going to go in and tell the new dentist right off the bat simply that you have had some bad dental experiences, have developed reservations about going and really have a lot of anxiety over it all now? I did with my current Dentist and I didn't get any lecture, he tries his best to not hurt me or scare me.

Poor man has a mess to deal with. I need total 5 extractions (2 done so far), had to get a cleaning done (first ever and I am 37), have 5 fillings to do (one done so far), and I will need a partial and deep cleaning ( I have some gum issues) before we're all done.

I think there are more than a few of us who let things go on before we go get it taken care of and maybe your new Dentist will know and understand. I'm hoping for you that will be the case.

 

[scaredstiff]

I am so sorry to read what seems to have been a catalogue of bad luck, misfortune or whatever you like to call it. However, I am sure that with this new dentist who has been recommended, you will be in safe, caring and compassionate hands.
The majority of dentists today would never 'scold' you for not looking after your teeth. They are understanding, non patronising and most now realise the extent of dental phobia in people and are catering to that condition.
It seems unusual also that you were expected to pay for extra shots. I think what you have to do, though I'm sure this would not happen again, is when you visit this new dentist, sit down, talk through all your concerns, of course let him inspect your teeth, xray whatever is necessary but make sure that you ask all the right questions, know exactly what needs to be done and the complete cost. Get it in writing too.
You say this new dentist doesn't do sedation, but that in any case because of your low blood pressure that would not be an option. I too have low blood pressure, but provided the sedationist knows your full medical history, what medication etc you are on, this should prove no problem It certainly wasn't for me. However, there are many different forms of sedation and I'm sure there will be an ideal one for you - again something that needs to be discussed with the new dentist.
If you can get answers to your questions before any treatment starts this will help allay the anxiety to a degree and less anxiety, more trust in the dentist will lead to probability of more successful and painfree treatment. Best of luck, and do keep us posted on how it goes with you.

 

[letsconnect]

Hi Finney , I agree that you should tell your dentist upfront that you're scared of negative remarks about your teeth (well, it worked for me, anyways ). I can totally empathize with your statement that "every visit and I do mean EVERY visit to the dentist I have EVER had has been at best unpleasant and at worst traumatic". However, with the right dentist, this circle can be broken . It's just plain bad luck that you had one bad dentist after another (also, I think that people with dental fears are less likely to walk out if they're not satisfied with the service because they have had their expectations lowered in the past... and of course, as a minor you often have no say in the matter).
It sounds though as if this time you have a good recommendation . We always suggest making the first appointment for a chat only, so that you can see if you like and trust the dentist. If not, there are plenty of fish in the sea!

Best of luck and keep us updated

 

[finney]

Thanks all for the support, empathy and understanding. It really does mean a lot to be among people how have gone through these feelings and know what I'm talking about.

The more I think about it I really do like the blanket idea. I know it's a bit like a kid having a "blankie" but hey sometimes it's about whatever gets you through, right? My cat's blanket is a normal polar fleece throw so I'm thinking maybe I can bring that and have him "there" with me too.

I have seen this dentist before, briefly. I have gum recession (dentists in the past say I grind and that's what causes it, but I swear I don't - my BF has never said I do and I don't have any of the other classic symptoms of bruxism). Anyway, it causes sensitivity sometimes that can't be managed too well via OTC means. The last time this happened before the most recent was several years ago, it flared up again about a month ago and I went to see Dr. M. He seemed fine then so I guess we'll see how he does when/if I need something "real" done.

I did make a new patient appt with him but I had to cancel it due to college finals - that week got WAY more out of control than I'd thought it would or had before and I just didn't have the time. My "check up" is what is on deck for Thurs.

 

[finney]

Appointment tomorrow

And I guess I just need to vent more than anything and get my thoughts out on "paper". I'm not scared of what I know is wrong, I have one small cavity (and I do mean it's small) and MAYBE another one, can't tell if it is or if it's just a stain. That's not the problem. The thing I'm scared of is what I don't know about.

When I found out I had my internal resporption the dentist wouldn't even tell me what he thought might be wrong until it was confirmed which might have been good for some people but was HELL for me, he just sat there looking at the x-ray going "is that really there? I've never seen that in someone so young. Oh my gosh." and wouldn't tell me what he even THOUGHT the problem might be. Then when I found out what it was I got upset - not crying or screaming or freaking out, just upset, and the hygenist said "I don't know what you're making such a big deal out of this over. I was born without my eye teeth and I have bridges and no one even knows unless I tell them." Well great...that's you. I wonder how she took the news when she FIRST found out?

Fillings I can pretty much deal with. It's anything else and worse, hearing the criticisms and the lectures and the "tips" that the condscending bleach blonde cheerleader types that always seem to be hygenists give you. I know it's part of their job but really...DUH. I know I should come in for regular cleanings. For one thing being a student I've lived on $900/month for the last 5 years do the math. Coming in wasn't an option unless THEY were gonna pay for it and second, it's really easy to say someone "should" do something when the person giving the advice isn't scared to death.

*sigh*

Anyway...I have a feeling sleep won't be happening tonight.

 

[vict4ia]

Hi Finney,

I merged your threads just to make it a bit easier for people to respond. It's sometimes easier if folks can see the whole history so that they know what to respond to.

If the dentist you'll be going to tomorrow is as good as he sounds, I doubt very much he would tolerate anybody in his employ giving condescending lectures.

Even though tomorrow's visit isn't going to be the "new patient" meeting, be sure to take some time to talk to the dentist, and maybe even the hygienist, about your fears and concerns. If we let other people know exactly what our needs are, those needs are much more likely to get met.

When I went back to the dentist after a 20 year absence, one of my fears was getting "the lecture". It didn't happen. As you acknowledge, it's the hygienist's job to provide suggestions that can help us to better take care of ourselves but any dental professional in "the know" these days won't be rolling out the soapbox to give you a lecture.

I hope that tomorrow's visit will see you well on your way to being able to manage your phobia.

 

[finney]

Well, it actually went OK.

I had the one cavity that I thought I had...but that was it. Dr. M was SO understanding. First we talked a little about what had happened to me in the past and why I was scared, and he said that I could feel free to stop at any time, just let him know, and we'd pick up where we left off next time; also if I didn't want him looking in my mouth at all today that was OK, he'd just tell me what he saw on the x-rays and we'd go from there.

He could have done a cleaning today, but I opted out of that and decided to do it next time...little steps. I was feeling a little mentally overwhelmed today so I figured it was better not to overtax myself.

When he asked to do the periodontal exam - the one where they just take the little pick and see how far it goes down in your gums - I asked if I could have nitrous and he had no problem with it. It was just that as soon as those x-rays come back and I was staring at them wondering what was wrong I just started shaking and couldn't stop. But, Dr. M was totally OK about it and got me hooked right up, and told me not to be afraid to ask for nitrous for anything at all if it would help me.

Now all I need to have done is a cleaning and that one little filling, and I should be good to go. He also took a look at the chip in my bridge and basically told me not to worry about it, so that was good to hear.

All in all a pretty positive experience. I think I got lucky with this guy, he was just as described.

 

[scaredstiff]

Well I think you've hit lucky and found the right dentist for you. So good when that first appointment goes well because it really does take the edge of your nervousness and make you realise that dentistry doesn't have to be painful and that the dentist is after all a human being just like the rest of us. So well done, congratulations, and here's to the next appointment going just as well.

 

[letsconnect]

That's brilliant, well done !!! So good to hear that the recommendation worked out so well and that your run of bad luck with dentists has come to an end .

Hope you'll get a chance to celebrate your success !!

 

[mikey]

Great job!
Your dentist sounds extremely nice and understanding...and I thought my dentist was nice

 

[finney]

Yeah, I was wow'd. I have posted a recommendation for him for WI, if anyone is interested.

 

[nina76]

Good work! And thanks for your comment yesterday. I'm so glad we both got good news today. And for some reason, the little metal hook didn't bother me. ..